Have you ever gone to the doctor for joint pain or a headache, only to be sent home with a prescription that doesn't help you feel better? Or maybe a physician told you that your symptoms are in your head and to just wait for them to resolve on their own? Most of us have grown up to believe that when health issues occur, there's a pill for that. But extensive research has moved towards more holistic practices that are good for the mind, body, and soul. This is where '"functional medicine" comes in. 

On this episode of Checkable Health's podcast, Patty Post joins Dr. Efrat LaMandre, a clinical and functional medicine physician who started a practice called, The Knew Method. Using a personalized approach to health care, Dr. LaMandre shares how she views a patient's symptoms holistically to address what's happening inside the body. 

Dr. Efrat LaMandre discusses her integrative methodology and how it differs from mainstream medicine. You'll hear valuable information, such as tips on dealing with ringing in the ears and Hashimoto's disease, as well as how to help prevent dementia and Alzheimer's diseases.

Listen to this informative podcast to learn more about functional medicine and how systemic inflammation may be the underlying issue for your health problems!

Topics discussed in this episode:

• The pushback on unfamiliar methods in medicine
• Dr. Efrat LaMandre explains functional medicine
• Her wife’s autoimmune disease and starting The Knew Method
• How to  start treating patients with this methodology
• Patient responses prescribed life changes
• What does “autoimmune” mean
• Thyroid issues like Hashimoto’s
• Elimination diet of The Knew Method
• How they support patients in sticking to their treatment plan
• Dr. Efrat LaMandre’s view of seed oils
• Slow progress is still progress
• Long covid symptoms and supplements

Learn more about functional medicine in Dr. Efrat LaMandre’s book, It's NOT In Your Head: Your Body Doesn't Feel Right But You Don't Know Why.

Tune in to her podcast, The Knew Method, here!

Connect with Dr. Efrat:

Website

TikTok

Instagram

LinkedIn

Facebook

Check out our podcast selection for valuable info on health, wellness, and more, and continue the conversation in the Hero Moms Social Group on Facebook! 

Connect with Checkable Health:

Facebook

Instagram

LinkedIn

Connect with Patty Post:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/patty-post/

About Checkable

Checkable is revolutionizing healthcare with fast and accurate at-home test kits, telehealth services, and a line of wellness supplements designed to keep you feeling your best while saving valuable time and money. At the forefront of home healthcare, Checkable is developing the first FDA-approved at-home strep test. Paired with a proprietary digital telemedicine platform to instantly connect consumers with healthcare professionals, you can skip the doctor's office and start treatment fast, right from the comforts of your home. http://www.testforstrep.com

Transcript: 

0:00:04.8 S1: Welcome to the Checkable Health Podcast, where we're helping everyday moms rethink how their healthcare begins at home. This podcast is for mothers of school-aged children, who were born in the 1900s and you’d buy an at-home strep test to check your child's sore-throat symptoms from home. Hi, I'm Patty Post, founder and CEO of Checkable Health. I'm mother to two amazing teenage sons and one tween daughter, and I've been married to my husband Andrew for almost 20 years. I believe that we all should be empowered to make healthcare decisions from the comforts of home. This podcast is designed to equip you to make those decisions from home through education, by interviews that I have with clinicians, thought leaders in the health space. Today my guest is Dr. E. Dr. E is a medical entrepreneur. Medical entrepreneur means she is trained clinically. She has multiple degrees in medicine, but she has spun out of conventional medicine to start her new practice called The KNEW Method. She's been practicing for a long time and she has over 20,000 patients. What she practices is called functional medicine. We have conventional medicine, think of your primary-care provider, think of taking a prescription because you have certain symptoms.

0:01:38.4 S1: What functional medicine does is what she's looking for is what is happening inside the body. Why are you having joint pain? Why are you having headaches? We really get into a conversation about what is an autoimmune disorder. We talk about things like Hashimoto's. We talk about how it all begins with our diet. Unfortunately, as I probably put too many TikToks out about Taco Bell, really bad for you, very bad. But like she said, if you're not eating Taco Bell every single day, okay, there are some things that you can have here and there. But overall, if you are going to diagnose what's happening in your body, she's got to start with a clean slate. That's what her KNEW Method is. It's a methodology that is really well practiced. She started with one client and now she runs a new method virtually. She has patients all over the nation. She is licensed to practice medicine, telemedicine in New York and New Jersey, but she can do The KNEW Method to anyone that lives in the country. So I'm signing up. Stacy, who works for Checkable, she has already signed up. She's got her hormones tested and we're going to start this, go on this journey.

0:03:06.0 S1: I really like it because she calls these people that are part of her weekly coaching “game changers.” So that's totally my style. I want to be a part of the game changer group, really hands-on coaching. If you have questions, don't go out into the world of Google and Google what you should do. She actually has the resources for you, which I think is awesome. I think there's a place for conventional medicine, but how functional medicine sure seems to have a lot of uptick in our society today. I'm going to remind you to also go to our podcast with Dr. Connealy. She is a functional medicine physician, and she focuses on the area of oncology. She is an oncologist. I love it. Dr. E is very approachable. She has a book that you can purchase as well, It's Not in Your Head. That's where a lot of people, a lot of physicians will really say, it's all in your head. The other thing is she does have a podcast that is The KNEW Method podcast. She has, what is her book? Oh yeah, the book is titled, It's Not in Your Head. So we'll have a show notes to that and we will be giving away a copy of her book as well.

0:04:33.0 S1: Really check out her TikTok. She has so many followers and then she gives away some really great advice. Really this podcast has a lot of great information. I encourage you to go over to her podcast. It's very geeky when you come down to supplementation, what's happening in your body. This last one, she talked a lot about mitochondria. Super interesting. With that, this is your first parlay into Dr. E, learning about who she is and I guarantee it you're going to love what she has to say. It just really goes into our empowerment of consumerism in healthcare, bringing it home, knowledge is everything. We can heal from within and that starts with food and then a proper diagnosis as well. So let's get into the episode with Dr. E. Enjoy. You started The KNEW Method. So I would love to first start with that because there are so few providers that go out and start something and it's very brave of you. And I think it's very brave because you are very, I mean being a functional medicine provider is different from traditional and you are not run by big pharma and I really respect that. I love it.

0:05:59.6 S1: So it's all yours. I'd love to hear what you say when, like what's going through your mind when I say that? So much is going on in my mind. The first is why we started, which I'll tell you in a minute. But the other thing, yeah, I mean functional medicine, you kind of have to be willing to take a risk, not just on the business side, but to make the statements that you need to make because there's going to be some hate and you have to like really, I'm so passionate about my patients that I'm willing to take the hate. And you could see if you go back to any of my beginning podcasts, I was scared to say things out loud. So I would talk about sleep and I would talk about hydration. I was scared to say the thing like IBS is not real and fibromyalgia is not acceptable. So cause now there's a lot of pushback and you have to be like, I'm here for you, I'm just saying this for you, not against you. I'm here for the patient. So there is an evolution in there, but to get to why I started and if, when you're in functional medicine, every single doctor and PPA that's in functional medicine is either there because they were sick or because their family member was sick and conventional medicine failed them.

0:07:05.2 S1: And this is not a diatribe against conventional medicine. I still practice conventional medicine. You need the meds when you need the meds. It's just not the full picture. And in her case, she had two severe autoimmune issues, PMLE and then psoriasis. For those of you who don't know, PMLE is basically an allergy to the sun. So yeah, go live with that. Yeah. So yeah, allergies to the sun. So we had to like, you know, live like vampires. When I do my talks, when I speak, I'm like, my wife used to be a vampire, but not the cool kind. I'm like, wait, why? So what would happen? What are the symptoms?

0:07:40.8 S1: So for most people with PMLE, it affects everything except for the face. They'll be out in the sun and then it's delayed. A day or two later, they will get a rash, they'll feel almost flu-like symptoms. And it takes a really long time to get diagnosed. Maybe it's lupus, maybe it's another autoimmune. Also because of the delay, it's not immediately after the sun, so it takes some time to make that connection. In her case, she had the A-typical form, so it actually included her face. At the time, she was a Division I softball coach. You can imagine she had to make a career change. Yeah. She made a career change for it?

0:08:18.0 S2: Yeah. She couldn't be outside anymore. Like that's how she got into medicine.

0:08:21.5 S1: Holy. That's nuts. So now medicine, she did a 180.

0:08:27.4 S1: She did a 180 as a full-grown successful adult. She could not be outside anymore. She went back to school and she became a PA. That was actually before I met her. Oh my gosh. so when I met her, she was already like a full-blown vampire and a full-blown PA. She’s a smarty-pants too and very brave. And then she got this. But we lived with it, right? As many of your listeners, you kind of live with it. You do the thing and you figure it out and you live with it. Whatever it is, your joint pain, your brain fog, you live with it. And usually something else pushes you over the edge. In her case, it was psoriasis. And her psoriasis was so severe, like she couldn't button her shirt, she couldn't hold or open things. She couldn't walk in her shoes. So that was like, okay, we have to do something. And anyone struggling with autoimmune, you know that it's either immunosuppressants or steroids. Again, not against it. There are certain people who really, really need it, certain diseases that need it. But we wanted, we knew there was something else, which is why I call it The KNEW Method because my patients always know.

0:09:29.4 S2: They know there's a better way. So this was a million years ago before the internet is what it is. And so someone told us about functional medicine and we're like, okay, this is not going to work. For those of you listening and not watching, my eyes are rolling heavily. It's not going to work, but we're like, we have nothing to lose, let's just go see this guy. Right. Whatever. And he had this crazy idea that this all has to do with her nutrition, which is outrageous. Right? Yeah. I'm joking.

0:09:59.6 S1: Wow. The things we put in our body actually affect how we…the same with whatever. Right? Yeah. And we were healthy, right?

0:10:06.9 S1: In air quotes. We were relatively thin, athletic. We felt we ate really well. Who are you to tell us that we're not eating well? You know, it's one thing if we're in McDonald's all day long, but we were not. We were like, eff it, let's try it. So we tried it. Her psoriasis disappeared, her PMLE reversed, and we got our life back. Okay. What's the timing? How long did that take?

0:10:28.0 S2: The psoriasis cleared up within weeks. Within weeks. She would take pictures and she's like, what's happening? It would just reverse. We would just watch it literally reverse. Wow. And then the PMLE was slow because it wasn't like we just went out and tested it because she could get sick. So all of a sudden we're like, wow, we didn't cross the street yet and usually she would get tingling, she would know it happens. She's like, oh my God, the tingling's not coming. And then we would stay longer and then longer. And now she could just, that's it. We're normal. We could be outside.

0:10:55.0 S2: Vampire life is gone. Vampire life is gone. Yeah. That's nuts. It's nuts. No meds, never needed it, just lifestyle change. So I was like, this is crazy. I have to bring this back to my practice. At that point, I already had a primary care practice, conventional medicine, and did the same thing that I, you know, accuse my colleagues of. I would tell people, you're fine. It's in your head. This is what I would do. Your labs are fine.

0:11:21.2 S1: I didn't know better.

0:11:22.1 S2: I didn't know better. There's no malice. I just didn't know better. So I started doing classes and just slowly bringing small things into my patients. And then I got my PhD in integrative medicine and I created The KNEW Method. So the reason it's a method is because I still come from a place of conventional medicine. So I want things that I can track, things that I can measure. I want to make sure that it's not just haphazard. So we created a method where we kind of dig, we do a discovery session with our patients. We get to know what's going on and then we use the software to track their symptoms and get into that a little bit more. But that's what The KNEW Method's about.

0:11:58.4 S1: So you don't just take the lab work and then give it to the patient, read it at their visit and be like, okay, bye. So I could tell you in primary care, I still do that because it's a volume-based business.

0:12:13.3 S2: Like we see 60 patients a day in primary care. It's just the nature of it. Again, there's no malice. Your primary care provider is doing the best they can within the constraints of a system that's designed a certain way. And in primary care, we are trained to find disease. If you have a disease, we'll treat it or refer you to the right person. If you don't have disease, there's no room for you in primary care. There is no room for shades of wellness. Hey doc, I know I'm not sick, but I still don't feel right. I don't feel the way I used to a year ago. Oh, it's just your age. Oh, it's just your hormones. Oh, you're stressed out. And it's not because they're bad people. There's no way to measure it in conventional medicine. There's no test for unwellness. Yes. Yes.

0:12:54.3 S1: Go walk, get some more exercise. Get some more exercise, more water.

0:12:58.8 S1: Yeah. What's going on at home? Is everything okay with your spouse? Like, you know, there's an insinuation there. That's why the name of my book is It's Not in Your Head because there's an insinuation that you're a little hysterical, especially if you're a woman. Yes. You're a little hysterical. So in functional medicine, we spend time with our patients because we can, because we design the system differently. We create a compensation strategy that's different for the provider. So we spend time. And we also understand that the lab is not everything, because the labs sometimes change later on. So I'll give a classic example. People know diabetes. I like to use this as a metaphor. If you're diabetic today, your test shows that you're diabetic today. Did you just become diabetic today? Of course not. This was 20 or 30 years in the making. So if I tested you five years ago and you weren't diabetic, that doesn't mean you weren't pre-diabetic. It's the same thing with sickness. You can have symptoms for years before the markers change in your blood. So because the markers didn't change, does that mean you're not on your way? Of course not.

0:13:57.4 S2: You were of course on your way, especially with autoimmunity. And so in functional medicine, we understand that the symptoms are telling us something. Something is wrong. Something is being agitated. And it's nice if it's validated by a lab, but it's not necessary because we're going to treat the symptom. We want the headache to go away. It doesn't matter to me that there's nothing on your MRI, that it's normal. You still have a headache. Why do you have a headache? Yeah. You have joint pain. It doesn't matter to me that you're negative rheumatoid arthritis. You still have joint pain. You still can't bend down to pick up your wallet. So that's the thing we're going to treat. So it's a completely different model.

0:14:34.7 S1: So how do you treat it then if you can't... So you're diagnosing with a symptom, but then how do you treat it if there's joint pain, for example? Yeah, that's a really great question. We understand that if you're unwell, something's triggering it, right?

0:14:49.4 S2: You have a headache, let's just go with headaches. Something's triggering it. So our goal is to figure out what's triggering it. So the very first thing we do is clean up your nutrition because that is what you have three times a day you're putting into your system. Most likely we're going to find it there. So we completely eliminate initially, not forever, right? Don't panic. This is not supposed to be rough for your forever life. So we eliminate... Because people are like, I can't do this forever. I can't do this forever. Yeah. So we eliminate and we see how do you feel when we bring you down to basics? If your headache went away, your joint pain went away, your stomach never felt better, your brain fog is gone, everything is wonderful. Well, now we know that something on your plate used to trigger you, right? It may not be something unhealthy. It may not. It doesn't have to be, you know, McDonald's. One day McDonald's is going to say something to me because I keep saying their name.

0:15:42.9 S2: I'm definitely not getting a sponsorship. So then, okay, I feel great. That's one scenario. I feel great, awesome. So now we're gonna start reintroducing things slowly based on that symptom. Okay, my headache's gone, my ringing in my ear is gone, my joint pain is gone, awesome. Let's reintroduce, I don't know, chickpeas. Oh man, you know, every time I eat chickpeas, my joint pain comes back. Guess what? Chickpeas aren't for you. So we reintroduce things based on those symptoms. Sometimes we'll completely eliminate and the patient's still not better, somewhat better and I'm not there. So now we know we need further testing, but not conventional testing, because we already did those. I do those to begin with. Okay. Do we need mold testing? Do we need hormone testing? Do we need heavy-metal testing? Do we need specialized testing? Maybe, depending on the symptoms, but I never start with those specialized tests because 90% of the time it's the plate, it's what's on the plate. So you peel it back, you peel it back, you go until you find it.

0:16:43.6 S1: Are people willing, once they get to you, are they willing to make that change or do you have people that are like, I'm not gonna change this. That's my enjoyment of life is eating my crap I like to eat. Yeah, most people are not ready.

0:16:58.7 S1: This is not volume-driven business. These are our patients, we call them game changers because they are ready to make a change. And they're amazing, they're the most amazing humans from all walks of life, all demographics, all politics, all shapes and sizes, the most amazing humans. Every Tuesday I have a call, it's called Tuesdays with Dr. E for my game changers and whoever wants to come on and we're national at this point, so people come everywhere. And every single Tuesday, it's the highlight of my week. I come off like a cloud just getting their energy. They're amazing humans. So they're humans that have hit a wall, they can't take anymore. Each one has a different issue going on. But the common denominator is that they're inflamed, they're not feeling well. And everyone in that group understands that struggle. So they're people who are ready, right? And they're ready and that takes resources, financial resources. And of course, yes, it's expensive, it's expensive, but that's a prioritization issue, right? Like we all know that we make some questionable choices with our finances. So where am I spending it? Am I spending it here or am I spending it here?

0:18:02.6 S1: Am I my own priorities, is my health my own priority? Time, time to meet with me, time to meet with my coaches. And then the decision to let go of the food that's causing it, at least give it a try. So not everyone is willing to do it. The people who do it are successful. I mean, it's just amazing. It's the most humbling experience people tell you, I've never felt better. These game changers. These game changers, they're just amazing. It's the most humbling experience. But I just wanna put it out there, like without judgment, if you're not at that place where you're ready, that's okay too. This is why my primary care practice is also still busy. I'm proud of you for going for an annual and taking your meds. If that's where you are right now on your journey, where you are not quite ready to make those moves, but you're at least showing up, getting your blood pressure checked, taking your meds, that's okay too. But when you're ready for more, just know that there is more, whether you work with us or someone else, but there is more to medicine. There is more to medicine than just the blood test and the pills.

0:19:05.2 S1: So what you're saying as a functional medicine physician, so I'm located in North Dakota. So I looked, I had Dr. Connealy on like nine months ago. If you know Dr. Connealy, she's in California. She's amazing as well. She has The Cancer Revolution is her book. You two are like cut from the same cloth. And she was my best episode. So let's get a little competition here. Let's see if you…episode and lessons. I'm okay with number two.

0:19:38.2 S1: I love empowering other women. If she's good at one, let her be one. I'm okay with two. Oh yes, you'll follow her now because you'll really like her. And you will not believe her age when you see her. And then you'll find how old she is. You're like, holy crap. Amazing. Yeah, she does amazing things for her patients, just like you were saying. She really focuses on oncology versus autoimmune. But in North Dakota, we don't have these resources. So as you're saying this, I'm like, I wanna be a game changer. So I can work with you. Or like my parents, my dad always loves to be healthy, but I know he makes bad decisions. He's 81 and in his mind, he's like 23. He could work with you, right?

0:20:27.3 S2: I mean, any of us. Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. So in New York and New Jersey, I can prescribe and adjust your meds. But outside of New York and New Jersey, we call it coaching, but I'm doing functional medicine. So I'm coaching you, I'm giving you everything that you need. And then if we need a prescription, I can say, hey, talk to your PCP. This is what we need. I'll even get on the phone with the PCP and say, hey, this is where we're at. I will do whatever it takes to help you move the needle. Or sometimes write a note. And most, I have to say most PCPs, if they see that their patient is improving, they've lost some weight, their numbers are getting better.

0:21:05.8 S1: They're like, yeah, it's just 100%, let's do this.

0:21:07.7 S2: They want their patients to get better.

0:21:09.2 S1: Yeah, totally. That's why you went into medicine. Yeah, exactly.

0:21:12.8 S2: I was surprised. I mean, we had to become national because of the demand. Cause just like you said, once I hit TikTok, everyone was coming from states that don't have this. And they're like, I am here, I am there. How can we work with you? Utah. Utah was one of my first patients. And they're like, hello. And I was like, oh my God, yes, let's figure this out. So. That's awesome. Yeah, it's been a humbling experience because I really truly believe that I'm here for a purpose. And it's not from me, it's from above. It just goes through me. And so when this happens, the more people that I can reach, and I know this sounds insane and maybe woo-woo, but the more people I can reach, the more I am fulfilling my purpose on this earth.

0:21:57.1 S2: You're right. That's amazing. Like what you were talking about your wife's story even, and then how you both are practicing this. Like she didn't magically go from being a D1 softball coach to being a PA. Like that's a divine plan. That's divine intervention. I just, I didn't know who I was speaking to, so I didn't want to go that, but that's divine intervention. And I said that too, because I would not have met her if she didn't have this disease. Because we met working in the emergency room together. So I'm like, I'm so grateful that you had this disease cause I met you like this.

0:22:30.6 S1: And then we started this journey together, but yes, it's a hundred percent divine intervention. So a friend of mine, she listens to this podcast. Her name is Madison. She was in, she's a very small woman, like less than a hundred pounds, was in the emergency room on and off for a year. And travels quite a bit. So unfortunately she was in, you know, ended up being in the ED instead of, you know, going to her primary care or going to specialists that knew her. She ended up being diagnosed with Hashimoto's. And that was my first time hearing like, oh, autoimmune disorder. So now you're saying autoimmune. I don't think a lot of people know what that is. And then specifically what Hashimoto's is. Now I'm aware of it and I hear of other people. So I don't understand why is it called autoimmune? Like how did those words, what does it mean? And then what is Hashimoto's?

0:23:34.5 S2: Autoimmune means that your immune system is attacking the self. Auto means self. Oh, got it. Okay. So auto means self. So it doesn't mean like auto or automatic, it's auto means self. So the immune system is attacking the self. There's something happening. And instead of attacking a foreign object like COVID or measles or whatever, it is now attacking the self. So people who have rheumatoid arthritis, it is attacking their joints. People have psoriasis, the immune system is attacking their skin. It's an autoimmune of the skin. People who have Hashimoto's thyroiditis, the immune system is attacking the thyroid. So autoimmune means the body's attacking. And then depending on your genetics or other things, it will express itself in a particular organ.

0:24:24.0 S1: This is why a lot of the treatment for auto-immunity is the same, both in conventional medicine and in functional medicine. So in conventional medicine, there's since there's understanding, oh, this immune system's fired up, this immune system is now attacking itself. Okay, here comes conventional medicine and they'll give you an immunosuppressor. Okay. That's why it's almost always the same meds, no matter what autoimmune you have, because the idea is just to calm down the immune system. Patient feels better, joint pain goes away, skin gets better, but the entire immune system has now been suppressed. So they are now susceptible to getting sick and then they have white blood-cell issues and can cause, the medication itself now can cause a lot of side effects. So if you can't find the cause of your auto-immunity and you're suffering and you're in joint pain or debilitated, of course, go to the rheumatologist, get those medications, but understand what's happening. So that's one way to treat it. Functional medicine says the same thing. Like I got it that you have a skin issue and you have a thyroid issue and you have a joint issue, but all of you have inflammation that's causing this auto-immunity.

0:25:29.2 S2: So we focus on the inflammation, which is why the same…similar, I shouldn't say same, a similar protocol for you will help your thyroid. And for the person next to you, that similar protocol will help their joints because their problem is not their joints or the thyroid, the problem is systemic inflammation. So it's right, makes, starts to make sense.

0:25:50.7 S1: It does make sense. So simple. It's so simple. We forget that everything's connected. Yeah. You go to the thyroid doctor for your thyroid, you go to the skin doctor for your skin, you go to the GI for the belly and you forget that's all connected. Hashimoto's is this. So thyroid issues, not going too detailed, thyroid means it's underperforming, the hypothyroid, there's also hyper, hypothyroid is underperforming, it's not producing enough hormones. So then you have to say why, why isn't the thyroid producing enough hormones? And there's a few reasons, but the most common reason why is an autoimmune thyroid issue. And the name of that autoimmune thyroid issue is Hashimoto's. Oh, okay. The problem with Hashimoto's, and I've done a few episodes and it's actually two weeks ago, I did another one because it's so common and it affects women especially, in this country. The problem is when you go for your annual, they will test your thyroid. My thyroid is low or my thyroid is normal or my thyroid is high. So it's a test, it's called TSH. Great, I got my TSH tested, doctor said everything's normal. So weird because I'm having trouble losing weight, my hair is thinning, my mom has a thyroid issue, my aunt has a thyroid, but every time I go to the doctor, they tell me my TSH is normal.

0:27:05.9 S2: So I guess I don't have a thyroid issue. Then you go along your merry way.

0:27:09.3 S1: So again, primary care is doing exactly what we were taught.

0:27:12.0 S2: We were taught TSH only, have a nice day. However, there is another test, which is called thyroid antibodies, which can show you if you have antibodies to your own thyroid, but we don't run that test in primary care. So-You don't want it? We don't run it. We don't run it. In primary care, it's not run. The assumption in primary care is that TSH is fine, the whole system's fine. In functional medicine, we're like, wait a minute, something's up. You have all the symptoms of thyroid, your whole family has thyroid. Why don't we test for antibodies? And so many times I will find antibodies, but their TSH is normal. Okay, so. You can test at home like an antibody test? No, no, no, it's a lab test.

0:27:58.7 S1: No one's ever invented that. They've never, and so that's why. No, it wouldn't make sense to, like you can have antibodies to a million different things. It's not one antibody. You're thinking of a COVID antibody test, that's specific for COVID. For COVID. This is specifically for thyroid. So what you need is a provider that's willing to run what's called a full thyroid panel, which is TSH, T4, T3, antibodies, reverse T3, but most providers won't do that. Not out of malice, it's just that TSH is normal. There's no medicine for it. Yeah. In functional medicine, we're like, oh man, you have antibodies. Your body's attacking the thyroid. Let's act on it right now before the thyroid has an issue. And what is causing your body to attack this thyroid? 99% of the time, it's gluten for Hashimoto's. Really? Yes. So you put the patient on a gluten-free diet, you clean them up a little bit, you take them probably off of dairy because it's a little inflammatory. You watch the antibodies go down, the patient starts feeling better, and hopefully they never develop the thyroid issue. If you already develop the thyroid issue, doing that will calm it down so your thyroid doesn't get worse.

0:29:12.3 S2: Because the point is, if you start understanding the thyroid Hashimoto's, it's not a thyroid issue, it's a systemic issue. You have to calm down the system, otherwise your thyroid's gonna continuously be under attack.

0:29:25.6 S1: It's literally under attack.

0:29:27.7 S2: It's literally under attack. It's literally, you should not have antibodies to your own thyroid. When you do, it's your body's actually attacking your thyroid. That's what Hashimoto's is. Yeah, it's when we produce antibodies when we are, like when you're sick, that's when you produce antibodies, right? When the body recognizes something as foreign, it attacks it. So it's not supposed to recognize the thyroid as foreign. But that happens with Hashimoto's. Just like it's not supposed to attack your own joints. Or if you have psoriasis, why do you have psoriasis? Why is your skin erupting? Yeah. It's erupting because your skin is your neon sign to your belly. Yeah. When your skin is off, your belly is off. You calm down that belly, the skin gets better.

0:30:14.9 S2: From when you were talking about you clean, let's clean them up. Do you like have you eat for a week, just five things just to keep it clean? No, no, not five things. We remove a lot of the offending agents, definitely more than five things. We don't want people hungry.

0:30:31.6 S1: We don't want strawberries and raspberries and I don't know.

0:30:35.4 S1: You talk a lot about that. We remove gluten, dairy, we temporarily remove all grains, all legumes. We limit the type of fruit. We limit the type of vegetables temporarily to kind of clear the weeds and clear out the field. And then as I mentioned before, we use this really cool software that tracks people's symptoms. So you walk in and let's just... So zero means you have no symptoms. And the further away from zero you are, the worse you feel. So you come in and your symptoms are 150. After this, a month later, we're gonna ask you your symptoms again and you won't have access to your previous answers. Keeps you honest, keeps us honest, keeps everybody honest so we can be accountable. And we want that 150 to go down to 100, to 70. You come back and you're like, oh my God, now your symptoms are 75. We're halfway there, one month in. It's amazing. I can't even tell you, it's amazing. I mean, I have people who say to me, this is the first time I've been able to play with my kids in the playground. You know, people who say, yeah, no, it's unbelievable.

0:31:36.3 S2: It's unbelievable how this affects people. It's just life-changing. I've had one woman who told me, I've been on allergy medication for the past 25 years. I haven't needed one. You know, just so many things that people just accept as their normal. Yeah. And it's just gone.

0:31:52.7 S1: That has to be hard though, because like when I start a new eating plan, I feel like crap. I get a headache, tired, like, oh my gosh, I can't do this. Is that what the coaching helps you through that first month? That's a great question. Yeah. So why The KNEW Method succeeds so well with our patients is because of the level of support we provide, because you're a hundred percent on point.

0:32:17.9 S1: I hand you a piece of paper, I say, I'll see you in 30 days. No way, that's not happening. That's not happening. So every, like I said, every Tuesday, an hour and a half, I'm right here on my Zoom, right here in this office, all my game changers hop on, whoever wants to, some, like they ask a question. So that's every single week. We have an app only for our game changers. When we have a live human there, Monday through Friday, there's a question, because we don't want you going down the vortex of Google. Should I take this? Should I not take this? Ask us, we'll tell you, right? And then on the app, we’re constantly putting in recipes and quick snacks and things to help you get through it. Some people are looking for salty, some people are looking for sweet, what can I do? And then you use as much or little of the support that you want. And we have some people who are like amazing, they're there for the whole hour and a half that I'm on, they're on the circle's name of the app every single day. And then I have some people who just hop in, hey, I'm between clients, but I just have a quick question.

0:33:13.6 S2: Great, ask the question and go. And then of course, every single month, they have a one-on-one with our coach and we make a new plan for the next month. But we recognize that if we're not available, you're gonna listen and you're like, yeah, I can do this, I can do this. Then you go home and you're gonna go into your kitchen and be like, what the heck do I do next?

0:33:30.8 S1: Right. You're gonna get like the Jif peanut butter and like an English muffin, because that's a fast snack that you can make. Yeah, exactly. And then also hearing from other people like, hey, this is what I do.

0:33:44.2 S2: Oh, that's a great idea. Hey, this is what I do. And it's so empowering. And then to hear everyone struggling through it.

0:33:51.0 S1: It's like therapy. I mean, therapy is so healthy, right? With our mental health that. Yes. It's holistic. It's a lot, what you're saying inside of the body, it's on our external factors. What's happening up here is connected with what you're putting in your mouth. And you can tell yourself a lot of things and rationalize the bad eating, right? Absolutely you can. You're like, it's peanuts. It can't be bad for you. Let me just have some. Yeah. Yeah. Yes. What do you think about seed oil? I've been reading a lot about seed oils, like, oh, stay away so bad. And my brother actually ended up finding he was allergic to all seed oils, corn oil, and safflower. Or safflower? Safflower is different than corn oil, right? Yes, different. Changed his life. Like you mentioned tinnitus, his ringing of his ears. Yes. Were gone after removing this. What do you think about seed oils? Well, before I go on to seed oils, I just want to say anyone suffering from ringing of the ears, unless it's like post-trauma people who are exposed to loud noises, just recognize that it's actually inflammation. And a lot of people suffer for years, not realizing it's your body telling you, we don't like what you're feeding us.

0:35:04.1 S1: And just like with your brother, you remove the offending agent and the ringing of the ear goes away. I've seen it time and time again. I ended up writing my thesis on it, that people are just, they're miserable for years. And I learned in school that tinnitus does not go away. I say tinnitus [tin-eye-tus], some people say tinnitus [tinni-tus], there was a whole war on TikTok about it. Spell is just whatever. If you have ringing in your ears, just know that unless it's traumatic or like secondary to hearing loss, there is a huge inflammatory component. And if you can modify your lifestyle, you can likely get rid of it, if not reduce it. And it's a game changer for people because people lose their minds from it, as your brother I'm sure would say. Yeah, you just lose your mind. Like literally. Yeah, it's horrific. So it's like an alarm going off in your head, like, oh my gosh, I am exploding inside. Not exploding, but you're so inflamed. Yeah, it's your body saying like, it's again, it's another neon sign. For that person, it's gonna be tinnitus. Like I said, for you, it might be eczema.

0:36:06.2 S1: And for this, another person might have joint pain, but, and he will notice that if his diet's off, the ringing in the ears will come back. Or if he didn't sleep well for a few days, it'll come back. It'll be his inflammatory trigger and he'll know, okay, let me get myself back on track. So he kind of has this internal, yeah. So tell him to pay attention to that. If he suddenly finds it coming back, there's something in his life again, that's happening, that's causing that. As far as seed oil, corn is the devil. No corn, no high fructose corn syrup, just no corn. Not because the vegetable itself is bad, it's because what we've done with it in this country, we've put it in everything. And so now it just raises our insulin, raises our inflammation. We've made a mess of what corn should be, which should have been like corn on the cob once in a while. So we've made a mess of it and it's in everything. So no corn. As far as seed oils, I would have to say, it really depends on the patients. I have some patients who do well, some patients who don't do well, but avocado oil and olive oil is kind of where it's at.

0:37:10.1 S1: And the coconut oil, that is really where it's at. Okay, that makes sense.

0:37:14.1 S1: Like not to, you're not gonna have a thing of canola next to you. Yeah, no, that's, you should not have canola oil. Like, yeah, I know it's a hard one guys, cause it comes in a big jug. Let's try to stay away from that one. For those of you listening, don't get scared that it has to be perfect. You know, when you're on social media, everything looks, oh my God, I'm eating kale and I'm making a smoothie and everything looks so easy. And obviously we did like 1600 takes before we showed you the smoothie, let’s be real. Let’s be real. It doesn't have to be perfect.

0:37:48.5 S2: You have to meet the patient where they are. For some people getting them from a full sleeve of Oreos to one or two is a win, is a win, right? So let's get the wins that we can. And sometimes it takes, I did not get, if you see what I eat now, it took me years to get here. Right, so first I eliminated this, I eliminated, it's not overnight. So congratulate yourself for whatever you're willing to do. And it's not an all or nothing game. It's not all or nothing game. So wherever you are, if you're listening to this, wherever you are, if you move one step, that's such a win and don't forget that.

0:38:20.2 S1: Yeah, don't beat yourself up. And it is just eliminating things from your diet or else like you're stagnant. If you start walking 10 minutes a day, wow, great change in your life.

0:38:32.2 S2: 10 minutes a day, I'm glad you brought that up. Oh my God, I could talk forever. 10 minutes a day actually creates a chemical in your brain called BDNF, which is actually preventative for dementia and Alzheimer's. So 10 minutes a day, you think it's not a big deal, it's huge. 10 minutes a day of walking actually heals your brain. So do it. If you can do 10 minutes, that's all you got, go ahead and do it. It does not have to be Orange Theory, CrossFit with a cute outfit that cost you 150 bucks. It could literally just be put on your sneakers and walk around your block. It really could be that.

0:39:06.3 S1: My mom and I listened to your episode yesterday together. We were on a road trip and the long-COVID symptoms one, because she had COVID in September. And then my dad just had it a week ago. And so I'm feverishly, and my mom's a nurse, but I mean, she's old school, right? Like she's almost 82. And she has long-COVID symptoms. And literally her doctors are like, it's fine, now we're moving into harvest season. You have allergies. I'm like, no, this can't be, you have like this brain fog stuff. You've got some symptoms. So we were writing down, she was writing down all of the different supplements that you were suggesting. So I suggest anyone listening and you wanna learn what long-COVID symptoms are and then supplementation. So listen to that, I'll put it in the show notes. But my question to that is the timing of the supplements, because there's quite a few. Do you recommend taking them at different times of the day to be the most effective? It doesn't really matter with the exception of magnesium, which sometimes makes people tired, you take it at night, but nothing else on that list.

0:40:17.6 S1: By the way, if you want the list itself, I did a quick TikTok on it with just the list. Oh, great. I'm gonna link that too. Okay, that's just a list. Yeah, I did one that explains long COVID, and then people were like, you talked through the supplements too fast. And then I did one with just the supplements. You did talk through the supplements pretty fast, Dr. E, you know your stuff. We had to go back, it was great; I'd rather have you like to get it out, it's great.

0:40:44.8 S2: Yeah, because I try to get it, you know, like in 20 minutes, so I go through and I figured people can pause.

0:40:49.9 S1: Totally, there's 30-second rewind. Yeah, exactly. So long COVID, it is a big thing.

0:40:58.4 S2: But here's the thing, it's not just COVID. It could be just about any virus that you had. If you still feel lingering, a lot of patients say ever since, ever since I had this really bad cold, ever since I had mono, ever since I had, I haven't been the same. The only reason we talk about it as long COVID is because it affected so many people that conventional medicine is inundated with it. But viruses for some people, they're just gonna knock you off your game. Long COVID, I talk about it because it was really specific to how the COVID virus enters the cell. But the reason conventional medicine doesn't deal with it, again, it's because there's no medicine for it. Because of the treatment, right? The treatment is: make sure you're not eating a lot of sugar, make sure you're anti-inflammatory, make sure you're walking and make sure you're taking these supplements because these supplements are likely depleted and you need to help what's called ACE2. So who's gonna tell you that in conventional medicine? Nobody, again, no malice. There's just nothing you can do.

0:41:58.7 S2: ACE2, I've never heard anyone talk about ACE2 and you kept like, it's so great to learn. I think everyone listening just should listen to your podcast and watch your TikToks because you learn so much. I'm gonna tell you, I research so much before I do every episode. It takes me about six hours every weekend to put a 20-minute episode together because I want to make sure it's strong stuff. And because I was taking apart long COVID, I was getting angry. My wife was like, what's going on? I'm like, I am so angry that no one talks about this. I'm like, this is crazy. Why aren’t we fixing everybody? She's like, calm down. Like, no, because the more I went into the rabbit hole, the more agitated I got. I'm like, oh my God, this is real, it's fixable. You know, like, oh, so that particular one.

0:42:44.0 S1: That's like, infuriating because it's like we could make so much of an effort to get everyone vaccinated, but then what happens after you have COVID? Why can't we talk about that? How to take care of ourselves? It's a real thing. It's a huge, huge, huge thing.

0:42:59.6 S2: Yeah, that one really agitated me. Sometimes I get very passionate about these topics.

0:43:05.6 S1: I love it. Okay, thank you for going over. It's 12:12. I want to be respectful of your next patient because I know you’ve got a full day. I'm going to sign up. I'm going to be your patient. This, I want to be with you Dr. E. And Stacy, my executive assistant, she actually had, she's the one who introduced me to you. And she's going to be your next patient. She's already signed up. She's like a couple of weeks, you're going to meet her and she's hot. Oh really? Make sure she tells me that, the connection. Okay. I will. You'll like her. So thank you so much for joining me. Everyone, please follow Dr. E and all of her channels. We'll have you all listed. And I guess any words of wisdom for us that we could have before you go?

0:43:49.2 S2: Yes, yes. There's a reason I call, the book is called, It's Not in Your Head, because I want you to know it's not in your head. And the reason I call it The KNEW Method is because you always knew there was a better way. Trust your gut, keep going. Don't get frustrated. Just find the provider that will get it. That's it.

0:44:09.2 S1: I love it. Thank you so much, Dr. E. Have a wonderful weekend. Thanks for all that you do. You too. Thank you for your time. Thank you. Thank you.